Unexplainable grey
post Category: remote viewing
post postAugust 14, 2008

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Any backup information would be appreciated.
U.S. government.

I met Joe McMoneagle, one of the remote viewers who participated in the Stargate program in the US defense department. He has written a book which details the time he spent in the program and the work that was done. He could not publish the book until after the information had been declassified in 1995, and, at that, he could only publish events that were declassified.

Remote viewing involves selecting a "target" in any place or time and "viewing" the target by intentional visualization. There are specific techniques that were developed during the Stargate program to help improve the accuracy of the viewings and to help those who showed promise to fine tune their remote viewing skills.

The work that was done, according to Mr. McMoneagle, included viewings of specific target locations (like inside of a building), locating people (including hostages and captured agents), viewing events before or after they had occured, reading license plates and letters from a distance, and associative remote viewing (which is a predictive tool).

The defense department claims to have ended the program due to it's lack of practical uses for intelligence agencies. Being skeptical that the defense department is completely honest and forthcoming with all public information, I personally have doubts about whether the program has ended, but McMoneagle could not speak about those issues.

Since the program was in place for over 20 years, and since it employed a number of people to perform these tasks during that time, they apparently saw some value in the work that was being done.

Remote viewing lends itself to controlled testing better than most Psi phenomenon, and besides the government work that has been done, a number of people have been very successful in demonstrating this skill in controlled environments. In particular, experiments were carried out at Stanford University to examine this phenomenon (link below). Thanks for the question!

Horaayy..there are 13 comment(s) for me so far ;)

#1

Their conclusion was that they wasted a hell of a lot of money and time on this wild goose chase. There is a link below with the information you're asking for.
References :
http://skepdic.com/remotevw.html

Rev. T R wrote on July 10, 2008 - 6:00 pm
#2

Two ways of looking at this.

The reasonable approach: Experiments were conducted with no positive results so the idea was abandoned.

The paranoid approach: Experiments were run with positive results. We'll never hear about it because The Government is conspiring to keep it hidden from us.

Take your pick.
References :
pd

Peter D wrote on July 10, 2008 - 7:01 pm
#3

It apparently did work or at least a branch of the intelligence service thought so as it was funded for over 20 years. In answer to your question there is a difference between two. Remote Viewing is the acquisition of information about a specific person, place, thing, or event regardless of space or time. There is a specific protocol that must be followed to do this.

Clairvoyance is a real phenomenon, but it is only a possible outcome of a specific situation, the problem is that there is no way to tell when someone is accurate or when the analytical mind tries to make associations that are not real.
References :
http://www.learnrv.com or http://www.rvcommunity.net

Loren C wrote on July 10, 2008 - 7:03 pm
#4

Officially:
Russia, after the break up of the USSR, the information and research being done in former east block countries could no longer be adequately accessed and the program defaulted.

Germany, the program, (with the central base of operations in Mannheim) does not and has not existed since WW2.

U.S., it was a waste of money for over 20 years. The results were not sufficient to continue the program and therefore it was disbanded. Some information has been declassified, others have not due to national security.

Ask a specific question from someone inside and the official answer is, "I cannot confirm or deny that."

You will only get the official story if you can look at the funding for programs, compared to the results, and then read between the lines. I refer not only to official government programs but grants to universities and the like, along with the strings attached.

Edit: This information is openly put here for everyone.
Rev. Nice Guy, do you think "finding" Bin Laden, if he is in fact missing, is a priority? Who financed him and put him in power? Oh yes, that is when he was on our side. (lol) Look what happened to the one person who went against him openly, Col. Oliver North. He was scapegoated for the Iran Contra Affair, by the same people who put Bin Laden in his leadership position. George Bush Sr., who was then the Vice President, was responsible to oversee the CIA. He claimed he did not know anything about it, making him either a lair, incompitant to do his job properly, or both. What was the result? He became president. Now it is practical having a terrorist that keeps popping up when it is convienient, it keeps people from looking at things that could be considered questionable and possibly unconstitutional.
I have read enough of your answers, and you may possibly consider me to be one of the "conspiracy nuts" because I openly question things that I am not wearing patriotic blinders on. I used to wear those blinders, and was very "patriotic". That is one reason I went to work for the government. Now I would consider myself, informed patriotic, that attitude is what the U.S. was founded upon. Otherwise we would still be a British colony. I in no way mean to be insulting to you, I respect that you have every right to your opinions and beliefs. I do advocate questioning and being informed. One strong question is, who benefits from the information we are given? The benefits are not always that open and evident either.
References :

Lucas D wrote on July 10, 2008 - 7:45 pm
#5

Here's some back up information on it.I think the fact Bin Laden is still out there speaks volumes.Why wouldn't Bush have taken him if he could?As with all paranormal claims.When the dust settles there's nothing there.Except maybe conspiracy nuts trying to kick up more dust.
References :
http://www.google.com/cse?cx=006450987733407521261%3Aen4nuq_uphu&q=milatary+remote+viewing&sa=Search

Rev.Nice Guy wrote on July 10, 2008 - 8:08 pm
#6

I second Peter D on this one. The official report is that remote viewed showed little, if any, use in military applications.

However who wants to trust the government these days? Maybe I am paranoid but I wouldn't put it past the gov to keep something like that a secret if they found out it worked.

One thing to consider is that astral projection, similar to remote viewing has been practiced since the dawn of man by virtually every major culture.

Personally I would not mind trying a few techniques under a controled setting to see what the results were.

PS we haven't found bin ladin because of his ties to big oil and political big wigs. Just my opinion. But I think dude has some serious protection.
References :

Acid09 wrote on July 10, 2008 - 8:25 pm
#7

The website below is the official home page of the former research director of that program. The site has lots of information about the program, including the complete scientific evaluation report written for the CIA.

The bottom line is that both outside reviewers, a professor of statistics and a staunchly skeptical psychologist, agreed that the evidence for remote viewing was at least intriguing and at best it was conclusively positive. But this wasn't what the CIA wanted to know. They wanted to know whether remote viewing was recommended for use in active intelligence gathering missions. On this question the report was not so positive.

To put this into context, on one hand we have a research program that cost a paltry one million per year for 24 years, which is so small that it hardly registers above the noise level for most government research programs. And on the other hand we have tens of billions spent every year on the most sophisticated spy satellite and human agent intelligence systems ever created. That the really expensive method, which funds a massive military-industrial system, is preferred over the other is hardly surprising, and indeed that was the conclusion the CIA preferred.

Be sure to read the director's response to the evaluation, at the web link noted below.
References :
http://www.lfr.org/LFR/csl/index.html

http://www.lfr.org/LFR/csl/media/air_mayresponse.html

DR wrote on July 10, 2008 - 8:51 pm
#8

I met Joe McMoneagle, one of the remote viewers who participated in the Stargate program in the US defense department. He has written a book which details the time he spent in the program and the work that was done. He could not publish the book until after the information had been declassified in 1995, and, at that, he could only publish events that were declassified.

Remote viewing involves selecting a "target" in any place or time and "viewing" the target by intentional visualization. There are specific techniques that were developed during the Stargate program to help improve the accuracy of the viewings and to help those who showed promise to fine tune their remote viewing skills.

The work that was done, according to Mr. McMoneagle, included viewings of specific target locations (like inside of a building), locating people (including hostages and captured agents), viewing events before or after they had occured, reading license plates and letters from a distance, and associative remote viewing (which is a predictive tool).

The defense department claims to have ended the program due to it's lack of practical uses for intelligence agencies. Being skeptical that the defense department is completely honest and forthcoming with all public information, I personally have doubts about whether the program has ended, but McMoneagle could not speak about those issues.

Since the program was in place for over 20 years, and since it employed a number of people to perform these tasks during that time, they apparently saw some value in the work that was being done.

Remote viewing lends itself to controlled testing better than most Psi phenomenon, and besides the government work that has been done, a number of people have been very successful in demonstrating this skill in controlled environments. In particular, experiments were carried out at Stanford University to examine this phenomenon (link below). Thanks for the question!
References :
Stanford Research:
http://www.militaryremoteviewers.com/cia_remote_viewing_sri.htm
http://www.mceagle.com/remote-viewing/stargate/index.html
National Geographic Video: Telepathy
DVD Extra: Premonition

Tunsa wrote on July 10, 2008 - 9:07 pm
#9

If they found any evidence to back up remote viewing or clairvoyance, it would definitely be kept secret and go underground. That would be a very powerful weapon.

Considering our government lies about a lot of stuff, I wouldn't be surprised if they had supportive evidence and were actually using it.

People who think the government would never lie are living in a fantasy world.
References :

Arcanum Noctis wrote on July 11, 2008 - 6:05 am
#10

You may like to form your own conclusions. Here's a few links to check out. Some examples appear to be great hits. Others are a bit of a reach. I think the inconsistent results and inability to identify great hits from weak ones limits the practicality of remote viewing for espionage purposes.
References :
http://www.mceagle.com/remote-viewing/examples/
http://www.wintersteel.com/Remote_Viewing.html

Incognito wrote on July 11, 2008 - 9:40 am
#11

Basically not useful and yet did have many "hits" just not in a precise form useful for reliable application. Depending on point of view, much is easily dismissed as successful only by inclusion and a shotgun approach (be general enough, and you will generate a "hit").

Consensus was that the results were not useful for military application, and after 20 years seemed unlikely to get there. There wasn't necessarily a consensus on whether RV and clairvoyance exist in a form that might at some point have military application.

Well - what they got wasn't what they wanted, and do recall the goal was military use, not the existential question of whether or not such "skills" are imaginary or real. You can look up the results - validity and reliability were definite issues. Do you seek the remote viewer whose ability to identify the target location/persons is reliable, the one whose observations are specific, the one who ONLY gets correct answers consistently while consistently locating the target area, with no mislabeling.

The end result - the 20year period of testing tells you somebody took it seriously or was bureaucratically-minded enough to keep their own work continuously funded. If you are looking for gov't evidence that ESP exists, that isn't what they were looking for.
References :

Carol C wrote on July 12, 2008 - 8:44 am
#12

It depends on what you mean by "conclusions." If you mean the conclusions from the final CIA-initiated review by the American Institutes of Research (AIR) — a study which was started _after_ the remote viewing program was closed and which based its conclusions on less than 2% of the data the program produced — then the conclusion was that real results had been demonstrated by the scientific research but it was never useful for intelligence work. If you mean by "conclusions" the actual data produced and reviews provided by actual intelligence community consumers, you would find at least one "intelligence community first" (the equivalent to a major newspaper scoop in journalism), a number of successful projects that actually resulted in action by intelligence, law-enforcement, and military assets, and data produced that was unknown by the US intelligence community but later confirned to be accurate. So you can choose between the conclusions of the politically-motivated AIR study, or the conclusions of the people who actually used the remote viewing-produced information.
References :
"Remote Viewers: The secret history of America's psychic spies," by Jim Schnabel
http://irvalibrary.com/index_AIR.html
other books listed at http://www.irva.org/books.html
http://www.irva.org/
http://irvalibrary.com/

Rviewer003 wrote on July 12, 2008 - 3:46 pm
#13

I don't have to know the answer to this. Rviewer and DR always have the correct answers. But..just so I don't get in trouble about not posting an answer….I think they're probably still secretly doing it. There are probably both skeptics and believers in the government. ..so they're probably watching each other.
References :

Deenie wrote on July 12, 2008 - 7:33 pm
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